How should Black parents talk to their kids about the police? Gene gets into it with his friend Chenjerai Kumanyika, host of Empire City, a podcast about the history of the NYPD. Chenjerai’s show sprang out of his own attempts to talk with his young daughter about the police and what they do.

This episode was produced by Jess Kung and Xavier Lopez. It was edited by Courtney Stein. Our engineer was Josephine Nyounai.